Tag Archives: You also

Islam is not inherently violent

30 Nov

On extremists, Lady Warsi, the UK’s first Muslim Minister, added: “Islam, like all other major religions, is not inherently violent. Passages from sacred texts must be taken in context. It would be possible to distort quotes from any religious text.”

What planet does she come from?  Has she never read the Qur’an?  It is full of violence against infidels and apostates.

But then she says the bit I love, “It would be possible to distort quotes from any religious texts.”

So firstly, all the exhortation to violence is a distortion!  No need to worry about that then, thank goodness. Secondly, other religions can also be said to exhort violence.  Oh well, that makes it OK then!

This argument is the classical and false Tu Quoque argument so loved by Muslim apologists. Tu Quoque means “You too”.  Of course, two wrongs don’t make a right.

Yes, other religions may have violent texts but the adherents of those religions don’t commit suicide,  blowing up churches, mosques, temples and public places.  They don’t take joy in using their texts to justify beheadings, stonings and honour killings.

And is it just coincidence that there are wars all the way from China to Turkey, whenever Muslim countries have borders with non-Muslim countries?  And even between Muslim countries?

Islam IS  inherently violent.

By their fruits you will know them.

How Radical Islamic speakers win arguments

5 Nov

Radical Islamic speakers are masters of the use of Tu Quoque. ” Tu Quoque” is Latin for “You Also”.  It is a well known, if fallacious, form of argument.

They avoid dealing with a criticism by reponding with a “You also” criticism. Then the questioner is seduced into a defensive position.  The better response is that two wrongs don’t make a right, then to return to the original point.

Here is a good example.

Q: Now, the United States government says that you are still funding military training camps here in Afghanistan for militant, Islamic fighters and that you’re a sponsor of international terrorism.… Are these accusations true? …
Osama Bin Laden: …At the time that they condemn any Muslim who calls for his right, they receive the highest top official of the Irish Republican Army at the White House as a political leader, while woe, all woe is the Muslims if they cry out for their rights. Wherever we look, we find the US as the leader of terrorism and crime in the world. The US does not consider it a terrorist act to throw atomic bombs at nations thousands of miles away, when it would not be possible for those bombs to hit military troops only. These bombs were rather thrown at entire nations, including women, children and elderly people and up to this day the traces of those bombs remain in Japan. The US does not consider it terrorism when hundreds of thousands of our sons and brothers in Iraq died for lack of food or medicine. So, there is no base for what the US says and this saying does not affect us.…
Source: “CNN March 1997 Interview with Osama bin Laden” (PDF)

Tu quoque was widely used as a way for the Muslim community in Rotherham to avoid criticising their Muslim brothers for grooming and raping 1400 underage girls over a 10 year period.  Their response was outrageous.  See the link below.

https://thoughtsforourtimes.wordpress.com/2014/11/04/islam/

Mohammad was not a Paedophile

4 Nov

Was Mohammad a Paedophile?

I was reading two people arguing about whether or not Mohammad was a Paedophile.  Part of the argument that he was one was:

The Prophet wrote the (marriage contract) with ‘Aisha while she was six years old and consummated his marriage with her while she was nine years old and she remained with him for nine years (i.e. till his death).” Sahih Bukhari Volume Seven, Book 62, Number 88. -the “prophet” himself.

He was 51 when he married her and 54 when he consummated the marriage

The response was a “Tu Quoque” argument.  “Tu quoque ”  is Latin for “You Also” and is an invalid form of argument.  You deflect a criticism by criticising back rather than addressing the issue.

So that no one would say I’m not even-handed, let’s keep to all the rich stuff that’s true, and let’s cut the Mohammad and Aisha pedophilia crap right out. King Alfonso X of Castile married Violant of Aragon when she was 10 going on 11 and valiantly tired to get her preggers for several years before finally lucking out (after she finally started having her period). And that’s just one Christian royal example of many.

So that’s all right then.  Mohammad is absolved.

No.  Paedophilia is always wrong. The Muslim Messenger, Peace be Upon Him, can’t wriggle out of it by deflecting the argument.  The behaviour of both of them is wrong.  And two wrongs don’t make a right.

Mohammad was not a Paedophile

And there’s the rub.  We can’t really judge either of them using modern standards.  That was how things were done in those days.

There is a difference however.   King Alfonso X of Castile is not the role model of a worldwide religion,  a role model for 1.5 billion people.

Mohammad is a Role Model

Mohammad, on the other hand,  is regarded as THE role model for Muslims.  He lived a sin free and perfect life and should be emulated by Muslims for the rest of time.  So he did no wrong in marrying a six year old and other Muslims can copy him.  They do not regard it as paedophilia.

Muslims Condone Paedophiia

You don’t believe it?  Read this fatwa written by no less an authority than Ayatollah Khomeini.

A man can marry a girl younger than nine years of age, even if the girl is still a baby being breastfed. A man, however is prohibited from having intercourse with a girl younger than nine, other sexual acts such as foreplay, rubbing, kissing and sodomy is allowed. A man having intercourse with a girl younger than nine years of age has not committed a crime, but only an infraction, if the girl is not permanently damaged.

1400 Young Girls Groomed in Northern England

Do these attitudes help explain the behaviour of Pakistani men in Northern England.  And there girls were also Kufr, or infidels, non believers.  Beneath contempt.

Have a read of this excerpt from an article in the Times Newspaper at the end of October in 2014.

Ansar Ali, from the campaign group Together Against Grooming, said that although most men convicted of child sexual abuse in Britain were white, there was evidence that Pakistani Muslims were “disproportionately represented” in street-grooming sex crimes.

“There’s no simple link with culture or religion, but we can’t sit back and say this isn’t an issue that’s relevant for us. This is our community and we have a duty to do something about it.”

However, some in the audience challenged these views. One said that “secular, liberal values” should be “in the dock” instead of Pakistani Muslim men.

Iftikhar Ahmed, the Tory parliamentary candidate for Bradford East, was even more sceptical. “I’m Pakistani and I’m not a sex groomer. Why are we putting the focus on Pakistani men and on Islam? There are thousands of white paedophiles in this country. We don’t put the same focus on Christianity.”

Nazir Afzal, chief crown prosecutor for northwest England, said that by speaking out he had previously been accused by fellow Muslims of handing racists “another stick to beat us with”.

Did You Spot the Wonderful Responses?

Here they are again.

However, some in the audience challenged these views. One said that “secular, liberal values” should be “in the dock” instead of Pakistani Muslim men.

This is “Tu Quoque”.  Return a criticism rather than deal with it.

Iftikhar Ahmed, the Tory parliamentary candidate for Bradford East, was even more sceptical. “I’m Pakistani and I’m not a sex groomer. Why are we putting the focus on Pakistani men and on Islam? There are thousands of white paedophiles in this country. We don’t put the same focus on Christianity.”

This is also “Tu Quoque”.  Return a criticism rather than deal with it.

Nazir Afzal, chief crown prosecutor for northwest England, said that by speaking out he had previously been accused by fellow Muslims of handing racists “another stick to beat us with”.

And this is “Tu Quoque”.  Return a criticism rather than deal with it.

The Police are Attacking Islam rather than Paedophiles!

The upshot is that the Pakistani Muslim community, while acknowledging that people in their community do this sex grooming, do not agree that they should be tried and convicted! The police, it seems, are attacking Islam rather than paedophiles!  The perpetrators should not be criticised.

Underage Marriage in the UK

More than a dozen Muslim clerics at some of the biggest mosques in Britain have been caught on camera agreeing to marry off girls as young as 14.

Undercover reporters filming a documentary about the prevalence of forced and underage marriage in Britain for the television program ITV Exposure secretly recorded 18 Muslim imams agreeing to perform an Islamic marriage, known as a nikah, between a 14-year-old girl and an older man.

Campaigners against forced marriage — which is not yet a crime in Britain — say thousands of underage girls — including some under the age of five — are being forced to marry against their will in Muslim nikahs every year, and that the examples exposed by the documentary represent just “the tip of the iceberg.”…..

The full story can be found at: http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/4017/uk-muslim-underage-marriage.

This story leaves me flabbergasted.  What they are doing is illegal.  Yet these imams are willing to collude in the breaking the law of the land and possibly encourage child rape, otherwise known as paedophilia.  The arrogance.  They don’t have the courtesy to obey the laws of the country that succours them.

But I’m not surprised.  Thank you Mohammad, that all perfect role model.